What Is Capitalism? What is Socialism? A Look at Some Noncapitalist Modes of Development

Mayur: I am all against uninhibited and all pervasive capitalism. Of course,the government enterprises should have an active role to play in the economy which should, however, vary from time to time. All the citizens should have access to the barest essentials, but strictly on need basis. Besides, I am all for giving teeth to the working class.

But communism, in my opinion, is a bit unnerving. In the societies which are quite addicted to liberty, people will find it unbearable to have the government’s boot on their throat everywhere,all the time. Capitalism existing side by side with socialism, that’s what I advocate. Wealth distribution and wealth creation both are important. There has to be a good incentive to create wealth, and, the economic inequalities have to be made tolerable. Enterprise, prosperity, and, the general well being of the masses. Something for everybody.

Yes this is what I want as a socialist.

To me socialism just means anything less than totally unregulated capitalism.

Socialists are people who are willing to limit the profits of the capitalists. Of course capitalists are people who believe in no limits their profits.So anyone who believes in limiting the profits of capital is anti-capitalist in a sense. Those people who want to let a market exist but to limit the profits of capital are called socialists.

Socialists also believe in redistribution. This means taking or even stealing money from the rich to give to the middle classes, working classes and the poor. This is antithetical to all models of capitalism. All models of capitalism call that theft.

Really what I am talking about here is social democracy.

Also, you can have workers running enterprises for themselves and keeping the profits. This is socialism to me.

Socialism to me is compatible for the profit motive. Capitalism to me is exploitation. No exploitation, no capitalism. Just because someone makes a profit, they are not necessarily capitalists.

One man businesses are not capitalist. This is simply a worker selling his labor power on the labor market to other workers. Labor markets are compatible with socialism as is single proprietorships.

The Cooperative Mode is a noncapitalist mode.

Actually the Japanese model, which is similar to the economics of Nazi Germany or National Socialism, is also a noncapitalist model.

My credit union is owned by the its consumers. That is a noncapitalist mode of development.

Many nonprofits do extremely well and hire many workers. That is a noncapitalist mode of development.

This thing that some call State Capitalism is actually a noncapitalist mode of development. Some call Russia State Capitalism.

The Chinese model is also a noncapitalist mode of development. This has also been called a form of State Capitalism.

City and town operated businesses can often be run very well especially if they compete against other cities and towns. This is the Chinese model. This is a noncapitalist mode of development.

19 Comments

Filed under Asia, Capitalism, China, Economics, Eurasia, Government, Japan, Labor, Left, Marxism, Regional, Russia, Socialism

19 responses to “What Is Capitalism? What is Socialism? A Look at Some Noncapitalist Modes of Development

  1. Magneto

    I’m tired of rich people talking about how compassionate they are, meanwhile they sit around buying Ferraris and huge boats and private airplanes and massive mansions.

    Meanwhile they become rich by fucking over the 99 percent. Capitalism is a pyramid scheme.

    • Magneto

      “I’m better than you” the rich person says to the poor people, showing off his ferrari and huge wealth.

      Nevermind the fact that it was by CHEATING the common man that they acquired such wealth in the first place.

      How much longer are people going to tolerate the pyramid scheme called capitalism?

    • Mayur Varshne

      I agree with you, there to a great extent. The capitalists are moderately to completely indifferent and manipulative.

  2. “socialists are people who want to limit the profits of capitalists”

    You must mean defacto.

    A socialist believes in government ownership of at least some industries and it is to provide many goods and services for citizens.

    Non-socialists can want regulated capitalism….

    with all due is respect this is a “no true Scotsman” fallacy.

    • Some Capitalists can object to Laissez-Fare.

      You’ve said before that Keynesians are welcome in the alt-left, yet you seem extremely hostile to anyone who is not a socialist.

      • That’s not true. Keynesianism with regulated capitalism and a safety net is a good system. That is called social liberalism. In other words, the Democratic Party. Problem is I think it does not go far enough. Look at the record of the Democratic Party. How many of them are even very good social liberals anymore? I think the record of the Democratic Party shows the limits of social liberalism. Sure, Johnson and even Nixon (!) were great, but it mostly downhill after that.

        I’m not hostile to anyone not a socialist.

        Whenever you see anyone on here or anywhere else on the Net, in the media or in society, have you ever noticed that approximately 100% are laissez faire kookjobs who hate any type of socialism as much as they hate Communism. Have you ever noticed that approximately 0% of them are Keynesians like you? Keynesians don’t usually refer to themselves as capitalists.

        Why don’t you just all yourself a social liberal?

        Social democracy usually boils down to not a whole lot more than seriously regulated capitalism and a generous safety net really. And they call themselves socialists. People in the Socialist International call themselves socialists, and address each other as comrade. The anthem of the Socialist International is The Internationale.

        • I will admit Keynesianism has sort of been bastardized from its original form in recent years.

          Believe it or not must GOP leaders are Keynesian now.
          They believe that because Banks stimulate spending in people who would otherwise not be able to, through giving them money.

          So people like Stephen Mnuchin are really Keynesian.

      • A capitalist, who runs a business, objects to laissez-faire? They have a pretty poor record of that. Study their lobbies. They object to all regulation and all new taxation on themselves. The agenda of the Trump Republican Party is the agenda of US business and the US corporations. They want to zero out government and zero out the corporations. That’s pretty much the position of most corporations in the US today.

        83% of small businessmen vote Republican. Ideologically, they are our enemies.

        Getting away from laissez faire means putting limits on the profits of business. Show me one businessman who willingly limits the profits of his business just to be cool or be a good guy or whatever.

    • Mayur Varshne

      Industries of critical concern to a nation and public utilities should be the sole concern of the State. In addition, the industries in which it is absolutely essential to have limited suppliers or even a single supplier in order to bring the economies of scale into operation should have a very active State participation.

    • I agree with this. Vital industries need to be state owned for cost control without shortages (like pharmaceuticals).

      I suppose I am a bit of a socialist.

      • Mayur Varshne

        I am a very pro people capitalist. I am a bit too familiar with the classes. Besides, I am full of compassion and kindness. But, I respect enterprise, passion and hard work.

        That’s why I am heavily biased in favour of a mixed economy.

  3. You are portraying Laissez-Fare/ Supply Side Capitalism as all capitalism.
    They are not.

  4. Mayur Varshne

    ….Socialists are people who are willing to limit the profits of the capitalists. Of course capitalists are people who believe in no limits their profits.So anyone who believes in limiting the profits of capital is anti-capitalist in a sense. Those people who want to let a market exist but to limit the profits of capital are called socialists……

    In the developed countries, the blue collared workers are paid adequately but, if I am not mistaken, the White collared workers are somewhat underpaid. This apparent anomaly, if any, should be duly rectified by the capitalists unless it is the immigration of much cheaper skilled to highly skilled immigrants which is pulling the salaries down.

    Capitalists should be made to share the profits to a significant extent on a proportionate basis with the skilled, semi-skilled and unskilled workers. However, the capitalists have to be handsomely rewarded as the risk bearers. There can not be any alternative to that.

  5. For many people, happiness is the car they drive and the house they own. Like kindergarten, the boy with the most toys is the happiest in the room.

    • Mayur Varshne

      Social inequalities including the economic ones exist even in the non-capitalist societies. They can not be eliminated though the State can keep them in control so that there is enough breathing space for even the pretty common folks.

  6. Lindsay
    As you yourself have said before, as the U.S. becomes increasingly more non-White, things are going to get crazier and we have to fight a right-wing tide.

    For instance, I saw regular GOP people (not dark enlightenment types or anything) saying we should just send the NAMs to a suicide land invasion of North Korea (I suppose the feel okay with South Korea, Japan or parts of Alaska/Hawaii being utterly destroyed, and do not fear Chinese/Russian response?) to get rid of them.
    You cannot make this stuff up.

    So these are obviously people who are not sympathetic to other people and would probably not even vote for a safety net, much less socialism.

  7. Mayur Varshne

    …….Socialists also believe in redistribution. This means taking or even stealing money from the rich to give to the middle classes, working classes and the poor. This is antithetical to all models of capitalism. All models of capitalism call that theft…….

    Taking away money from the rich mostly in the form of higher direct taxes seems to be the norm almost everywhere.

    Stealing money from the rich, however, is extremely challenging. Besides, it results in the large scale flight of capital from the economy. It can be done once in a blue moon and then too it will have serious implications for the economy.

    Of course, the State can always take extremely punitive measures to deter tax evasion.

  8. Jason Y

    Even though the Japanese and South Korean models are nationalist and have less of the capitalist features than the US or say El Salvador, there was still a civil war in Korea (after World War II) much as we see in Latin America – of course, culminating in the Korean War. Also, Japan is massively hated even though it’s economic model is not hardcore capitalism.

    • Jason Y

      North Korean propaganda always harps on the fact South Korea is a cruel harsh capitalist hell – despite SK’s mixed economy.

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