UK Blacks Now Matching UK Whites on Achievement Tests

Jm8 writes:

The average scores of UK born Blacks are near or above the White norm depending on the immigrant group, according to data from achievement tests which correlate strongly to IQ (and g)

http://www.unz.com/article/the-iq-gap-is-no-longer-a-black-and-white-issue/

http://www.unz.com/article/closing-the-black-white-iq-gap-debate-part-i/

Yes, they currently match Whites on achievement tests in UK. However, I am not aware of any recent data showing corresponding rises in UK Black IQ scores. But I am not sure if their IQ scores matter if their achievement test results are so good.

50 Comments

Filed under Blacks, Britain, Education, Europe, Europeans, Immigration, Intelligence, Psychology, Race/Ethnicity, Regional, Whites

50 responses to “UK Blacks Now Matching UK Whites on Achievement Tests

  1. Jason Y

    Not surprising as the UK is much more advanced than Africa, in so far as the environment, and especially, the knowledge of genetics is concerned.

  2. Jm8

    The Maths and English sections of the tests have about a .7 correlation to the g factor measured in iq, about the same as the SAT’s in the US. I believe different types of iq test have a similar correlation to one another(will look for source on that), so that is pretty high.

    http://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/wp-content/uploads/Intelligence-and-educational-achievement.pdf

  3. I must admit, this is interesting.

  4. Mixed people in the UK happen to be on par with whites in IQ.

    https://lesacreduprintemps19.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/glassessment.pdf

    When I showed this to a racist on YouTube, he lost his shit!

  5. If they are immigrants, then this is to be expected.

    However, if the range slight varies with these groups then this could go into insight of possible ceiling effects on closer magnification

  6. Santoculto

    UK is a very socially rigid society, maybe there are greater differences between social classes. I read that professional social class tend to score 107 in cognitive tests while working class tend to score 97.

    Other problem is the definition of who is black and who is not black. UK seems have adopted the american rule where mulattos are treated as black too. (keep in the head Malcom Gladwell as generic ”british black”).

    UK is one of the most anti-white nations on earth, what i read and hear about this ”kingdom” is that the ”british” government are forcing mixing race, holocaust doctrination and white guilty in a rampant way. They think also the idea that ”britishness” is a multicultural identity, while englishness and other insular ness (lake**) is ”older”, non-cosmopolitan and deserve disappear, etc. Well, exactly what happened with micro-cultures as french basque or Cornish.

    Capitalism and specially macro-capitalism or globalism is the greater enemy of human diversity.

    Of course, Britain is one of the most powerfull european nations, interesting to note that is exactly in the western superpowers where ”gramscian doctrination” is more intense. Why** British people also look very very ”pure” caucasian breed, with a greater % of red haired people there.

    Chisala believes that african immigrants in Britain are not ”selected” by social class or cognitive capacity, they are just the average subsaharian (and if you think different than him then you are racist). He also use very anti-scientific terms as ”white privilege” or slavery legacy” to explain why afro-americans tend to score lower in cognitive tests (proxy for professional intelligence) and tend to have greater proportion of dysfunctionally non-empathetic people.

    I dislike a lot about your texts because he use ad hominem all the time and he believe that your weak and little ”evidences” are final proves that subsaharian blacks are just like clones of white europeans.

    Chisala act exactly as a white nationalist that despise completely the faults of ”your precious race” and manipulate facts to corroborate with their own ego.

    Black people who defend ”your people” and despise completely own faults AND defend things as discrimination against whites (specially), in my opinion, just can be two ”things”

    contextually stupid (contextually, because is completely normal and common, you are very good in some cognitive or intellectual capacities and to be stupid in others, humans are both stupid and smart, of course will be a individual and collective variation of this cognitive duality),
    inside the anti-social spectrum.

    Chisala don’t understand or don’t want understand that leave Africa to live in USA or in Britain is not easy, you need guarantees as good/reasonable income, community help or good credentials.

    Improvement of environment circumstances maybe cause biological improvement (still we don’t have any causal prove that its happen in large scale. Some human mother can have a good pregnancy even in bad environment while others will be more sensitive/ less effective autoimmune system).

    Flynn effect is very misunderstood and complicated. We have to be honest with ourselves, we don’t have truly, concrete idea about what really is ”Flynn Effect”. Probably a combination of technical (non-standardized tests) and conceptual (iq = intelligence while the right to say would ”iq correlates and express partially well the intelligence) mistakes with some logical environmental correlations.

    • Jm8

      “Other problem is the definition of who is black and who is not black. UK seems have adopted the american rule where mulattos are treated as black too. (keep in the head Malcom Gladwell as generic ”british black”).”

      Mixed people have their own categories in the studies. Britain does not typically use the one-drop rule. The british born blacks listed as such have two parents classified as black. In many cases the parents are immigrants.

      • Santoculto

        Yes, i know, but i think in England this type of research tend to be made by self identification, is not*

        ”Britain does not TYPICALLY use the one-drop rule”

        Yes, but they still use. Northern europeans are more naturally/visually prone to perceive this phenotypical differences, basically because they are more different than mixed (northern europeans are extremely outliers in phenotype, what i already said here.)

        Even in countries like Barbados and Jamaica, seems white british had mixed less than in any other latin american nation. Its cultural but visual/ self perception too.

        • Hey, it’s me phil.

          Now I understand everything you said for being skeptic towards Iq growth in these populations and believe me I’m skeptical as well.

          I could agree on near everything you said but……I’m still some boggled with How Mixed Black Populations that have not even 30% white admixture managed to be at Mulatto levels of IQ.
          For example, Afro Cubans are slightly “Lower” at IQ than AA’s or AB’s bt have far more admixture in them based on that Carribean Posts.

          What are your Guesses?

        • Santoculto

          Some evidences that Chisala show are evidences about itself and seems canno’t be extrapolated alone to explain a macro-scale phenomena (transcontinental higher proportion of black dysfunctionality) because look like a micro-scale: specific. Chisala say that for example, somali students in Seattle ”are not selected” because they are come from variable social background. He no have other prove that corroborate with your claims.

          Is very important to analyse very well specially this bugs, exceptions, as well any other study, called PRECISION, what science should work. But seems human sciences indeed ”are not” a ”exact sciences” (ciências exatas in Brazil or STEM in anglosphere).

          Racism for black people is a reinforcement of inner-”inferiority” like when a father despise the implicit homossexuality of their son. The father will develop/nurture this fake idea that their son is intrinsically inferior because of their sexual condition. He will try see their son in a masculine light, exaggerating their distorted and unrealistic (scape) perspective.
          Is cruel, counterproductive and zionist, of course. Look so good and correct the REAL racial/human bio realism than this ”positive-liar thinking”. So better.

          Whole racism narrative look exactly like ”down syndrome positive thinking narrative”. Exaggerate the good side (always have a good side) and discard the bad side.

        • Santoculto

          Phil,

          metaphor for the studies about flynn effect: ” grope in the dark .. or better, in a very weak light ”.

          My guess is that when there is a large selection pressure, there will be a tendency for the stabilization of cognitive and phenotypic characteristics of a mixed population, because this is consists of an unstable population at the beginning of its creation.

          One of the characteristics that differ from the mestizo those who are decanted race, is precisely the stability of the characteristics. It seems to consist of a general trend, always walk for logical harmony (contextual).

          Mestizo populations tend to be more variable in their characteristics, it appears that is not so important to have 50% of ” white mixture ” or 20%, because, especially in relation to intelligence, greater intelligence, tend to be recessive, ie can be highly heritable in a family level (certain families), but not when you have two people with different levels of intelligence getting married (and specially with addendum of different biological background). It is also important to understand right if the mulatto, white mother of children, tend to be more or less intelligent, than the mulattoes, who are children of black mothers.

          Recently I read on twitter James Thompson that the percentage of admissions of people with schizophrenia plummeted. On the other hand, there has been an exponential increase in cases of autism. The spectrum of schizophrenia and psychosis in general tends to relate low birth weight, while that autism tends to relate to the exact opposite. There has also been a drop in IQ scores in space tests, Germany.

          We have some probable certainties regarding macro-contextual proportional differences in intelligence and behavior between races, and many variables or possibly epigenetic fluctuations that may have limited/relative impact and should be studied with more precision and care. Finally, we need to separate very well what is environmental or ‘learned / imposed’ ‘what is innate.

        • Thank for the reply.

          How the genes are combined or how the characteristics are organized were along the lines of what speculated.

  7. asdasd

    Christ, the comments.

    Yes and African immigrants in USA also have high IQ and Indian average in USA is probably 115 – because it’s the upper part of the bell curve that is emigrating.

    • asdasd

      African americans in USA earn
      African American : $38,705[4]

      While Nigerian americans earn
      Nigerian American : $57,375[4]
      and Indians earn
      Indian American : $86,135[3]

      Why do you think that is?

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_groups_in_the_United_States_by_household_income

    • Jason Y

      The upper bell curve doesn’t always lead to more income, unless that IQ is applied to something making money. Some philosophy BA major, or a smart guy unwilling to work can very well wallow in poverty.

    • That’s what I thought too, but based on what the researcher says they are “average” for their nationality and that’s whats getting focus, but I’m highly skeptical if not opposed to the claim.

      However, like what Robert mentions, the averages vary by ethnic group and that dives into a discussion on whether certain ethnic groups in the Sub Sahara aren’t restraint by the 70 mean.

      James Thompson did a piece that shows how the data similar to that above is unreliable to authentically indicate such, however he also stated he’s not opposed to such an Idea.

      The primary guy who is diving into the topic is Peter Frost who has done a few articles talking about this and he believes the Igbo are a prime candidate based of the reputation they got in success in Nigeria.

      While I’m unsure of Chisala’s claims, but it’s an interesting topic considering that IQ does vary even within a race between it’s ethnic groups.

  8. Toe Jam Football

    To JM8
    Who linked:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_Abilities_Test
    It appears that the link above describes a US based test that is separate from the one used in the UK. Regardless it does appear that the CAT used in the UK corresponds well to IQ tests as Mensa accepts it as a proxy.

    Some interesting figures.
    Indians outperform British whites on the GSCEs by more than 20% yet under perform on the CAT by one point. Chinese are at the top outperforming British whites by 6.6 points. Mixed white/African are just one point below British whites whereas mixed white/Caribbean are roughly 3 points below and the average for African and Caribbean blacks is 7 points below British whites.

    One comment on akarlin.com claims that:
    The test was carried out to test 7th graders(12/13 yo), and IQ/Cognitive abilities gap between groups get larger as people age (Gradual gap appearance).

    https://lesacreduprintemps19.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/glassessment.pdf

    http://akarlin.com/2012/08/minorities-cognitive-performance-in-the-uk/

    • Toe Jam Football

      To Rob:

      Who asked: < i>Can you show me where UK Black Caribbeans are scoring 94 IQ? I thought the IQ of British Blacks was 86.

      See above, but note a poster on Akarlin’s site claims that the test referenced by Man of Sin was conducted on 12/13 year old children.

      • See above, but note a poster on Akarlin’s site claims that the test referenced by Man of Sin was conducted on 12/13 year old children.

        That is much better than black children in the U.S.

    • Jm8

      “The test was carried out to test 7th graders(12/13 yo), and IQ/Cognitive abilities gap between groups get larger as people age (Gradual gap appearance).”

      The Ethnic gaps (across the key stages) on the in the achievement tests do not tend to show a gradual widening but rather seem to narrow with age if anything.

      See:

      https://z139.wordpress.com/2012/04/05/a-gaping-hole-in-the-masters-evolutionary-theory/

      and:

      Minority Ethnic Pupils in the Longitudinal Study of Young People in England
      Extension Report on Performance in Public Examinations at Age 16
      Dr Steve Strand

      http://dera.ioe.ac.uk/7916/1/DCSF-RR029.pdf

      “Some gaps change very little. For example the relative gap associated with social class, mother’s educational qualifications and entitlement to a FSM did not change substantially over the three time points. Other gaps did show substantial change. For example the gender gap increases significantly, from less than 0.07 SD at KS2 to 0.23 SD by the end of KS4, with the largest shift occurring between KS3 and KS4. The gaps for some ethnic groups decrease substantially, for example Pakistani, Bangladeshi and Black African mean scores were significantly below the White British mean at KS2 and KS3 but these gaps narrowed to less than 0.1 SD by the end of KS4, again with the big change happening during KS4.”(Steve Strand)

      The GCSE key stage 4 (discussed in the Chisala articles) scores are taken around the age of sixteen but. The CAT sores given are from a younger age group (11) and more closely match Group performances at the same age GCSE evaluation stage (Key stage 2)

      Social class gaps are still significant, more so than most ethnic gaps. This seems to go against the idea of grade inflation as significant cause of ethnic gap narrowing.

      https://z139.wordpress.com/2012/04/13/race-class-and-cognition-in-the-uk/

  9. Toe Jam Football

    To Jason Y:

    The upper bell curve doesn’t always lead to more income, unless that IQ is applied to something making money. Some philosophy BA major, or a smart guy unwilling to work can very well wallow in poverty.

    True, but in my experience educated African, Indian, and Chinese immigrants invariably focus on professions where they think they can make the most money with their abilities so I strongly suspect that the correlation between income and intelligence for the above immigrant groups is markedly higher than for white Americans.who were raised middle class.

    • Which link is it above? And can you tell me how you decided that the UK CAT is different from the US CAT?

      • Toe Jam Football

        Admittedly a guess but take a look at the Wikipedia entry, the CAT referenced by JM8 is authored by a professor from Iowa:

        “The Cognitive Abilities Test (CogAT) is a group-administered K–12 assessment intended to estimate students’ learned reasoning and problem solving abilities through a battery of verbal, quantitative, and nonverbal test items. The test purports to assess students’ acquired reasoning abilities while also predicting achievement scores when administered with the co-normed Iowa Tests. The author of the test is David F. Lohman, professor emeritus at the University of Iowa.”

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_Abilities_Test

        Then search for CogAT UK. You won’t find anything.

        The UK CAT seems much more broadly applied and appears to be authored in the Great Britain:
        http://www.gl-assessment.co.uk/products/cat4-cognitive-abilities-test-fourth-edition

    • Jason Y

      Could be Americans are spoiled. Third world people come from tough places where money is scarce, so given the opportunity they bust their ass.

      • Toe Jam Football

        Could be Americans are spoiled. Third world people come from tough places where money is scarce, so given the opportunity they bust their ass.

        Plenty of evidence to suggest that 1st and 2nd generation Chinese and Indian kids work harder academically than American whites, but the same can not be said for Latinos. I’d say it comes down the parents culture and outlook.

  10. Toe Jam Football

    To Rob:
    Regarding GCSE, there has a been dramatic rise in the scores in the UK since the late 80s. Basically the percentage of students who have achieved A*-C in the last 30 years has nearly doubled.

    http://dera.ioe.ac.uk/4428/2/Educational_inequality_mapping_race,class_and_gender(PDF_format).pdf

    Sounds a bit like grade inflation (and runs counter to the American results with SAT/ACT scores…). Lower the bar enough and everyone is a winner.

    • Toe Jam Football

      I’ll try that link again, may not work because of parenthesis in the URL
      http://dera.ioe.ac.uk/4428/2/Educational_inequality_mapping_race,class_and_gender(PDF_format).pdf

      You can also search for Educational_inequality_mapping_race,class_and_gender(PDF_format).pdf

      • EPGAH

        It’s the comma that’s breaking it, not the parentheses!
        But you’re right, lower the bar enough and everyone IS a winner, particularly if you add “Grievance Classes”, like African American “Studies”, Chicano “Studies”, etc.

        Basically, these fields could be called “Why It’s All Whitey’s Fault”.

        And coincidentally, these “studies” were how North Carolina’s sports teams kept their As to play sports!

    • Man of Sin

      Everyone is a winner except the Irishi Travelers.

      • Santoculto

        Sometimes you can have a statistical-analytical noise because you are comparing a greater population (still) as white british (more than 40 million people) with minorities, indians and chineses for example.

        Again, greater study in Japan found average iq among 104, white americans in other research score 102.

        Is not ”east asians score 105, and whites 100”. Differences seems little.

        What made east asians and woman more ”behaved” is not exactly intelligence but personality type or better, personality intensity/dominance.

        yes, donde están el leftoid charlatans (a lot of jewtard) to excuse very lower scores among irish travellers*****

        I have the answer, because they are WHITE!!!!

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