Here is the chart that has the women all hot and bothered, mostly bothered frankly.
It was not my intention to write a work of misogyny here. In fact, one of the main things that repulses me about the MRA, MGTOW, Alt Right, PUA/Game movements online is the utterly wild misogyny of almost the entirety of these spheres. I am almost literally repulsed by that sort of over the top misogyny.
On the other hand, the more intelligent of these guys insist that their misogynist views are empirically or at least philosophically true. I find this concept very disturbing. It means that I have been wasting my life being entranced by females and the world of females. I have been immersed in a world of nothing, for females are nothing. Possibly better, I have been wasting years of my life immersed in something insipid, for females are insipid.
Now I admit that these notions bother me because I don’t like to waste my life. But the alternative, I guess, is to live in the utterly boring world of men and sit around with guys discussing philosophy.
The reaction of almost all Western women to this chart has been that it is a work of misogyny, and that is shows females are inferior. I do not agree. It only shows the truth, and the truth cannot be misogynist. I doubt if the truth proves women are inferior either.
However, I just spoke to a SE Asian friend of mine, and I showed him this chart. He said, “Is this supposed to be controversial or something?” Then he said, “This is just true, that’s all. It’s simply the truth.”
On further questioning, he said that all SE Asians, male and female, agree with these dualities, and they all support them 100%. I asked him if the women were mad about these categories. He said, “Of course not. Even more, they support them and encourage them.” Men and women both encourage males and females of all ages to more or less follow the natural gender roles which are summed up in this chart. No one is mad about any of this stuff. Instead, they just think it is normal, natural, right and correct.
This suggests to me that Western women, led by feminism, are waging a war against Nature, and Nature always bats last.
The first five principles are by Otto Weininger, but the last 56 are by me.
Characters Masculine* Feminine* Principles Activity Active Passive Consciousness Conscious Unconscious Thinking Objective Subjective Genius Yes No Productivity Productive Nonproductive Energy Generative Receptive Mind Thinking Feeling Emotion Stoic Moody Tactile Callous Sensitive Humor Slapstick Irony Weather Calm Unsettled Temperature Cold Warm Graph Linear Scatterplot Empathy Poor Rich Pain Inflict Receive Confrontation Forward Withdrawal Reaction Contemplative Reactive Style Deliberative Unthinking Intensity Concentration Distraction Denial style Projection Fantasy Egotism style Narcissism Histrionic Pathology Sociopath Borderline Defense Anger Denial Ego desire Expansion Dissolution Depression Sublimation Immersion Reliance Self Others Compassion Little Great Wakefulness Aware Unaware Alertness Wide Awake Sleepwalking Planning Methodical Conspiring Morality Strict Contingent Aggression Physical Subterfuge Violence External Internal Warfare Bully Victim Hierarchy Dominant Submissive Force Blunt Subtle Texture Harsh Smooth Resistance Extreme Yielding Linear Straight Jagged Presentation Forthright Devious Surface Clear Opaque Understand Simple Complicated Logic Linear Circular Movement Stiff Flowing Grain Coarse Fine Instrument Blunt Subtle Transport Highway Stream Route A to B Roundabout Tour Autobahn Scenic route Flight Soar Flutter Hobby Monomania Dilettante Truths Multiple Singular Theory Branching Obsessive Fact Durable Momentary Manichean Yes Grey Area Systematics Categorizing Noncategorizing Science Empirical Intuitive Philosophy Tough Dream State Ubermensch More common Less common Body Hard Soft Tissue Sinewy Fatty
Ok…so it’s not misogynistic at all to characterize females this way:
Sleepwalking (alertness)
Passive (activity)
Subjective (thinking)
Non-Productive (don’t tell your mom this over thanksgiving dinner!)
Reactive
Unthinking
Unaware
conspiring
subterfuge
Devious
obsessive (theory)
momentary (fact)
dream state (philosophy)
Do you Seriously believe this? So ridiculous.
Yes of course. But I am not sure about the nonproductive part.
No, it’s not misogynistic at all. Of course those are all feminine traits, but men display them as well of course. For instance, men definitely conspire, but it’s not a very male thing to do. But are pretty up front about things.
Robert, I couldn’t make it past the first half. Maybe I could rewrite it?
Masculine:
Willing to believe stupid half-truths that overly simplify and characterize complex human sex-linked traits into black-and-white inanities, which end up being true of basically no one
Feminine:
Smart enough to realize that humans are complicated creatures and that everyone has percentages of both sides in their character (if humans can actually be described as having such flat characteristics accurately), and that if humans did not have this complexity, then our species would not have made it this far.
Thank you, Carolyn!! This chart and Roberts male self congratulation has been bothering and irking me for months now.
This chart is not really an issue for me. I see the sexes as complementary, for the most part.
But what I don’t see is your evidence that women are “crazy.”
Simple, to us they are often “irrational.” If a man acted that way, other men would simply say he was irrational. He’s crazy. Do crazy people have reasons? Of course they do! Does that mean they are not nuts? Nope.
Blah, blah, blah. It’s not even making sense anymore. “If a man acted this way other men would simply say he’s irrational.” I forgot we didn’t get a vote.
Here is the website for Man Down with info/links about the studies. Enjoy.
http://www.mandownnews.com/
It is a woman’s duality from the men’s nature that makes her more attractive and interesting. However, feminists want to negate that, because deep down, they have a victim mentality and a psychological need to ‘measure up’ to man, by being manly and doing manly things.
Having said that, a lot of the traits you mentioned are subjective though. And probably influenced by the culture. In a lot of Indian cultures as I have observed, men behave in ways that appear as very feminine, something that will be socially disapproved in a western culture or a tribal culture like mine. Hyper emotionalism, an absence of objectivity and logic, (relative) physical weakness and softness, belief in singular truths and a general disorganised state.
All men have feminine traits. All women have masculine traits. Any member of either gender could frankly have any combination of masculine or feminine traits in their makeup.
I am talking masculine and feminine, how I define it. Sure, there are some cultures where I would see the men as more feminine or the women as more masculine.
I think that might be why females are so fascinating to me, because they are so different.
Yeah it can be summed up as women = irrationality men = rationality
Atheist Indian wrote:
“However, feminists want to negate that, because deep down, they have a victim mentality and a psychological need to ‘measure up’ to man, by being manly and doing manly things.”
I have acted more like a man since birth. I’m not a lesbian. I don’t see myself as a victim. This is simply my nature.
I remember the ‘women’s movement’ in the 70′s here in the USA. I came of age then, and the ultra-feminist rhetoric of the day was both empowering and confusing. I didn’t want to be a man-hater, or feel a need to apologize for my more feminine qualities. I think every female goes through at least one phase of ‘hating men’. We are very vulnerable to the more brutish, forceful and insensitive behaviors we see in boys and men, and we fear having to marry one of you!
Women do have to fight hard to be treated with respect. We are so different from males, and rely on you so much, that to get social and political equality can make some women into misandrists.
Atheist Indian wrote:
“However, feminists want to negate that, because deep down, they have a victim mentality and a psychological need to ‘measure up’ to man, by being manly and doing manly things.”
If only Indian men would follow suit! LOL.
Great stuff.
What do you think of the chart?
Its highly speculative. What do you think of David Deida’s breakdown of the same?
I do not know. Have not seen it.
Interesting. There was a time when I leaned towards feminism. It is the misandry that turned me off, it looked like just the opposite of misogny. Never been much for extremism. If you are naturally what we call a ‘tomboy’, it is not really an issue. As I said before, masculine and feminine qualities are subjective. As long as you are being natural and not forcing yourself on some feminine or feminist ideal, it is all right, really.
Coming to the respect issue, it is something that cannot be forced or socially engineered. Respect is neither universally given nor unconditional. Even men don’t respect each other without individual or social merit. You have to earn it. Even among men, equality is based on merit, some men are more ‘equal’ than others based on their economic status, social status, et. el. The problem with feminists demanding respect and equality is that they want it without earning it, just by the sheer ‘merit’ of being a woman.
Misogyny is as insane as misandry. They hate each other, but they are two sides of the same kind. If we men want women to love us, then we should love them as much as we want them to love us. It’s only fair.
Well said Robert.
Yes, then we were both turned off by the misandry, and with good cause. Misogyny does NOT entitle women an eye for an eye revenge binge. Social reform is the answer, and it may take decades, even centuries. I am a humanist, I value rights for all ages, races and genders. If one section of humanity hurts, we all hurt. I fall short of my goals, I have human weaknesses, but the lofty goal keeps me inspired and in line.
“The problem with feminists demanding respect and equality is that they want it without earning it, just by the sheer ‘merit’ of being a woman.”
How then, given what I just wrote, can they earn it? Did African Americans have to earn the respect of white men? No, they fought the civil rights war to get it! Now, they struggle in their own communities to raise their standards of thinking and living. If they tried to ‘earn’ respect, they would still be worse off than they are now. All people should be respected as a moral virtue, not because they have earned it. Do you respect your parents because they earned it? Poor thinking, on your part, there.
The above post is to Cathy Creswell. By the way, how do you get that little avatar in your posts? I can’t, for the life of me, figure out.
Welcome to the fight, Robert. “This time I know our side will win.”
Looks like David Deida plagerized this guy, but reversed some of the principles.
I understand the reservations of the first commenter here, that you (RL) are reproducing here problematic stereotypes (with historical lineage, but now seen, rightly or wrongly, as plainly wrong in ‘polite society’) of women as, basically, livestock. That has some charm but, right or wrong, these oppositions are deeply ingrained, and can be found to cross time and cultures, though with variations e.g. the Chinese notion of Yin and Yang. ( By the way, I heard, nearly 30 years ago, that there was a book that contained the most comprehensive listing and categorisation of Yin and Yang in Chinese culture – does that ring a bell to anyone? I’d like to know what it is, and have a look at it.)
In short, I think the oppositions are useful categorisations, by and large, but I’m not sure that men and women map on to them in a very tight fit. Your own list is pretty idiosyncratic. Just for fun, I’ll quibble some of them
m f
Humor Slapstick Irony
No, no, NO!! ” Women HATE wit!” to quote Jerry Sadowitz, Glaswegian Jewish stand-up shock-controversial (” Jews or Nazis? Right or Wrong?”) comedian, has to be accompanied by a bodyguard on stage. (This old VHS is the only available vid of him http://tinyurl.com/c3nb5qx ) Anyway, he doesn’t get to do much live tv, but on ones such rare occasion I recall him saying this very thing, and thinking to myself, ” yeah, that’s right; they don’t”. I think of all the times I’ve been trying to warm up some tarted-up trollop with my wry observations on life, jokes, quips…. while she touches up her nail varnish and occasionally chips in something about some other guy who’s got a HUGE penis, or HUGE motorbike, HUGE bank a.c., HUGE muscles… you …. in short: ” very amusing but what are you going to give me, and is it more than these guys got”… then someone shouts fire in the bar, everyone stampedes out and tramples someone to death under broken glasses and bottles, and she splits her sides laughing ” fucking LOSER!!! ha ha ha….” SLAPSTICK!
OK, that situation is what you call flogging a dead horse, but it’s still an example that rings true, And ‘ IRONY’! Oh please! Men don’t DO irony! Men don’t even recognise that kind of irony, y’know the new use of the word that’s crept in from the pomo scene, the inappropriate, let’s say it plain – the GAY – use of the word, to mean parody or sarcasm.
Next one:
Texture Harsh Smooth
Me, I favour a hairy/smooth dichotomy, as in the Biblical tale of Jacob and Esau ” My brother is an HAIRY man, but I am YEA an SMOOTH man!”
Theory Branching Obsessive
I thought obsessiveness was usually attributed to the male, and concomitant with stamina?
Ubermensch Common Uncommon
How can you have a common ubermensch?
You have an online profile? They can track you internet activity.
“Mind: Thinking Feeling”
Uh, Women think with their hearts (emotional), men think with their dicks. Which do you think should qualify more as “feeling.”
Low blow. Low blow. But I lolled,then felt guilty.
I don’t understand flight or grain. People can not fly except by machine. There is nothing natural about that. Most of these are not so much all encompassing or gender specific. These traits are fluid not stuck.These are mostly related to possible defaults of personality which aren’t controlled soley by biology but some mix of bio,and enviromental factors. It’s too binary.
Flight as analogy or mental flight.
It is all about balance and equality. If there is no balnce or equality between the two sexes then there will always be diffrences often resulting in conflicts and disagreements.
Yes men and women are different is a physical perspective and also a hormonal perspective. Therefore we need to be educated and have the basic fundamental knowledge pertaining to these basic difference between male and femal and then we can have a better understanding and appreciation for each other instead of the old hat mentality that man is superior to woman.
Today more women work as we live in a more complex and competive world, also we live in a world with a high cost of living and many western people are very material like all the trimmings ie nice home and car etc so they can not have this on a single wage/ income also 50% of women are single parents supporting atleast one or more childen so they have to work unlike years gone by where the traditional bread winner was the husband and the wife stayed home which worked quite well then.
The womens liberation movement/ feminists over they years have brainwashed many women and they now work and are more independent compared to women of previous generations.
If we look at nature the mother looks after her offspring and stays with them until they are strong enough and able to leave the home/ nest and fend for themselves, the father is the hunter and provides the food and protection etc so relating that back to the human species the old way was better that the new way today ie women stayed at home, kept the house in good order, cooked the meals and cared for the kids and the husband/ father went out to work and brought home the money/ wage and before the feminist movement evolved the greater majority of women where very happy with this role.
Why change something that worked so well? The children where happy and in many cases well loved and there was no need for child care.
Most people where far better off without the financial debts and huge mortgage repayments of today. In general people lived a a more simple and far happier better quality and standard of life ie in middle class America which back in the 1960′s and 1970′s reflected the majority of Americans.
Yeah, but my mother was miserable. As a stay at home Mom I understand her situation. It’s so mind numbingly boring, then mind altering frustrating the next minute. Women have a need for mental stimulation and to have a kind of work they can be proud of. Motherhood doesn’t not always deliver. It was a simpler way of life, and we were healthier to boot. We walked more and ate less. The cost of living was lower. So, it was a mixed bag.