Black Diners

From Gucci Little Piggy, who is by the way banned from this site for rudeness. Glpiggy is some kind of rightwing, Libertarian economics, HBD, anti-feminist and increasingly flagrantly racist blog in the Alternative Right blogosphere. Alternative right, whatever that means, right? What does it mean anyway? Why would anyone want to be Alternative Right? What’s so hip and cool about it anyway?

This is an interesting view of what it is like to serve Black people in a large restaurant. The Blacks show up en masse for the cheapest meal of them all, which isn’t even very good for you either. Buffalo wings, mozzarella sticks and ranch dressing are full of fat and possibly salt too.

There are lots of violations of basic White manners in this post.

Showing up en masse for the cheapest food of them all. Uncertain whether this is rude or cheap. A lot of Whites would probably do it, but something rings cheap about it. Marginal, tough call. In White society, when you all show up for the cheapest deal of them all, it means you’re broke and you don’t have any money. Or else you have money and you’re just tight. Neither of which looks good in money obsessed White society.

Bringing little kids and babies to a restaurant at 11:30 at night? Now that’s just weird. Most Whites would say that the little ones ought to be in bed at that hour.

Swapping tables? Wow. Bringing your food with you to the tables of your friends? Wow. Hard to say. We, or I, just don’t do that. Not that I can think of anyway. I mean, maybe did it in high school? It’s going to be big mess to bring your food to another table. Maybe you might go to the other table, but without any food, visit a bit and then leave.

Demand that the waiter prepare a special mix of French and ranch dressing. Now you are a demanding diner, demanding special favors from the help. That’s considered rude. Some Whites are rude. If you have a lot of money, you can be a demanding diner, but you should tip very well. At any rate, you are considered to be imposing on the table help.

Asking for a warm water bowl and a hot towel and a lemon to clean up. That is extremely demanding and a very strange request. Most Whites would consider that to be an outrageous and rude demand. Just go the restroom and wash up.

Demanding a plate of lemons so you can make free lemonade. Wow. Cheap and tacky ain’t the word! That is so low. Trying to get free food. Just order a lemonade and be done with it.

Refusing to tip. Yes, Blacks don’t tip. This is a longstanding complaint of many servers. Or if they do, they tip very low. I mean very, very, very low.

Making loud and rude passive aggressive remarks about the service. Wow. That is extremely rude. You just don’t do that. Unless the service is outrageously bad, and I can’t remember the last time that was true. You don’t complain about the help. In most cases, is it not obvious that they are going out of their way to win you over so they get a good tip?

Drug dealers ordering outrageously gauche and tacky to the extreme most expensive stuff out there. What to say? Whites would not do that. If you’re a drug dealer, and I knew a few, you play it cool and don’t show off. The more you show off, the more you are likely to get busted.

The Black drug dealer not only doesn’t tip, but he doesn’t even leave enough to cover the bill in the first place. Wow, beyond rude heading to the antisocial. If you’re going to order the most expensive stuff on the menu, well, you just have to tip, that’s all there is to it. And you have to tip well.

Ordering the most expensive stuff means you are bucks up to the extreme. In that case, you must tip well. And of course you must pay for your meal. Ordering the most expensive stuff on the menu and then not only not tipping but not even covering the bill, well, that borders on the sociopathic. Actually, it is sociopathic.

I waited tables at a chain bar and grill in college. They offered $1.99 baskets of hot wings and mozzarella sticks from 8PM-Close. The place would go from mostly whites to all black at 8PM, as the blacks came in for their $1.99 dinner of “buppalo wings” as they called them. We called the blacks “dub dubs” or WWs, the Wings and Water crowd. The black cooks in the kitchen would get a kick out of watching the Negroes run the white waiters ragged.

The blacks brought their small babies and children at 11:30PM for this wholesome meal, and often came in groups of 10 or more. Sometimes the entire restaurant was full of one hundred blacks who all knew each other and swapped tables, taking their baskets of food with them.

Tables of fat black women would order 4 or more baskets of food each, all with 3 or 4 greasy tubs of ranch dressing. They would demand that I mix the french and ranch dressing for them. It was just a flying mess of grease, napkins, bones, and lemons. I remember one woman asking me for a “warm water bowl with lemon and a hot towel” to bathe herself after eating.

These women would strip the wing bones clean in one bite. They drank gallons of water, demanded a “plate of lemons”, and then would mix in the sweet and low to make free lemonade. They always stiffed me on the check, and as you described, made loud rude passive aggressive comments about the service.

The male black drug dealers would order the $15 sirloin steak well done with double french fries and frozen top shelf Brandy Alexanders ($12 ea) from the bar. The men would always order frozen strawberry daiquiris with whipped cream. One time a guy ran up a $100 tab as if he was at a fine dining establishment. He did not even throw enough rolled drug cash on the table to cover his bill.

138 Comments

Filed under Blacks, Culture, Europeans, Race/Ethnicity, Whites

138 responses to “Black Diners

  1. Dano

    I worked for several decades as a busboy and waiter. In the upscale places, you can’t make a decent buck in the blue collar ones.
    If you work in a chain bar&grill, don’t be suprised at the behavior described.
    I rarely saw a stiff. Maybe 3%. A bad tip was maybe 30% of the time, unrelated to the level of service. I gave top service.
    People would always show up en masse, that’s the way it works, We called it the “bus getting off”. It was no big deal, other than putting you in the weeds.
    It’s dining room work, expect to get into the weeds. That’s what separates the pros from the greenhorns. Tips reflect that too.
    A bowl with warm water and a lemon and towel is normal. Particularly if shellfish has been ordered.
    No one demands anything from me. If they want a mix of dressings, I bring them the two bottles and let them mix it, they know what ratios they like.
    If I think they’re being demnding for the sake of beings dicks, I tell them it’s not available or we don’t serve it. That rarely happens, but it does occasionally. Typical requests are margarine instead of butter, skim milk instead of creme. I try to get it.
    Greenhorns work much harder and get pushed around. An example is a group that orders coffee after the meal. One person orders, when you bring it another says “Oh bring me one too!”…and so on. When I ask if anyone wants coffee, I make sure I interrupt all conversations…I say it loud and with an air of finality. Then there’s no excuse for the add-on game.
    When someone stiffs me they are remembered by me, and I don’t serve them again. If I have a maitre d or a captain that insists I take them, I will see them coming and splash water on the seats. When the Maitre d pulls out the chairs, he sees the water and takes them to the next station rather than make them wait till it’s wiped off. If that doesn’t work I give them “the business”. They will recieve the worst, most frustrating, most screwed-up orders they ever have. I will ruin their night. There will be no doubt what’s going on. I’ve never been fired because a good busboy or waiter is gold to a restaurant.
    The worst tippers were blacks and doctors. And Canadians.
    The best were Jews and single mothers with kids and assholes.

  2. Gay State Girl

    “Bringing little kids and babies to a restaurant at 11:30 at night? Now that’s just weird. Most Whites would say that the little ones ought to be in bed at that hour.”

    That’s where I would differ with these uptight whites who are afraid to take their children out of what they perceive to be their comfort zone. There’s a whole world beyond the classroom and I want my kids to see it. You know my favorite excuse? “It’s a school night.”

    • How can you talk for what most whites would say. You have no idea what whites are like in the UK. Seven year old white kids rioting, white men ransack my cousins business and so on. OH!!! i thought only blacks could do these things

    • I’m all for exposing your children to experiences outside the normal “acceptable” routines, but taking them to dinner at 11:30 pm isn’t teaching the greatest personal habits. There are millions of ways of taking them “outside the box” besides going to bed at 1 or 2 in the morning. Besides, once they are teenagers, they will be doing that in front of the video games on their own.

  3. Eliza

    Black people are notoriously rude guests and bad tippers. Most have been made that was by the broke white trash that offers terrible service in TGI Fridays, Applebee’s, Houlihan’s, etc. As for taking their children out when whites believe kids should be in bed, do you have any studies or statistics based on research to support such an accusation or are you relying solely on the experience of Tina the Trailer Queen. Come on now. Your blogs would be much more acceptable and believeable if they actually made sense. I’d much rather see a child in a restaurant at 11:30 pm than drowned by his own mother (something white people seem to enjoy doing). Get your facts together and come at us properly because right now, you sound real stupid.

  4. tulio

    I’ve heard the “blacks are bad tippers” thing enough to believe it’s probably true. I think much of the other stuff is widely exaggerated. I see blacks in restaurants all the time and I can’t remember the last time I’ve witnessed blacks getting rude and aggressive with staff. The tipping is probably a legit issue though. I also can’t ever recall seeing black kids running around a restaurant late at night. For one thing, most restaurants aren’t even open that late anyway. So I don’t know what this guy is talking about.

    And then he talks about blacks guzzling down $2 wing baskets and drug dealers ordering drinks. Well, sounds like this is restaurant that appeals to the lower rungs of society. What kind of clients would you -expect- to get in there?? It doesn’t sound like we’re talking about Spagos here.

    • Chullo

      tulio is an upscale black. he can’t believe that other blacks act this way. it’s simply impossible!

      • Dota

        About the tipping part. This is going to sound pretty lame but can you blame blacks for being bad tippers when they’re at the lowest economic rung of the ladder? When I was a student I never ever tipped since I was totally strapped for cash.

      • tulio

        What I get sick of is people judging the entire black race based on behaviors of people from the ghetto. What if I judged the entire white race by the behavior of white trailer trash? And said their behavior is “white behavior.” It’s obvious to me that the people that blogger is describing is probably your hoodrat crowd and these are probably restaurants located in not the best of areas.

        No, I don’t see all this unruly black behavior in restaurants. At least none I go to. I honestly don’t. Nor do I recall seeing any black kids out at restaurants late. At least not frequently enough for me to notice it.

        I have met some blacks who simply don’t believe in tipping. Their attitude is “why do we give people extra money just for doing their job?” I guess that’s the attitude in Japan as well since they don’t tip in Japan. You just get paid to do that job. I suppose it’s like that in some other cultures as well. I can respect the fact that not all cultures have the same outlook toward tipping. When you think about it, it is kind of stupid. If I had to rewrite the rules of etiquette, I’d get rid of tipping. Just pay wait staff a comparable salary. I don’t want to have to deal with the hassle of pulling out my tip calculator and then having to ask for change so I can leave some smaller bills on the table. Tipping in bars in annoying too. I stand in line 10 minutes, a guy grabs my beer out of a freezer, pops the top and hand it to me and for that I owe him an extra dollar. Seriously, why? I still do it just because it’s expected, but I think tipping at bars is dumb. I can see if the bartender makes the drink extra strong and you want to reward him. But most all drinks are poured weak and then they want extra money.

        Then you have places that have tip jars out that shouldn’t even have them. Like restaurants or coffee shops that don’t even really have any actual service. They just call your name and you pick up your order from a counter. Why the hell do they expect a tip for that? Or why does the skycap at the airport who sticks a tag on my bag and throws it on the conveyor belt think he’s owed extra money? What the hell did he do?

        • Car Guy

          lol, Tulio. Good points.

        • Alpha Unit

          Like you, Tulio, I always tip in situations where a tip is expected. But I appreciate hearing your views on this subject. To a lot of people, “ghetto” = Black, and disabusing people of this idea seems to be the hardest thing on earth.

          Also, I don’t know if there is any way to get rid of offensive, obnoxious behavior in the world. It’s fine to talk about how awful some people are, and how they ought not be that way, but some people are going to insist on being offensive, no matter what!

        • Dota

          Gold star Tulio

          We don’t tip in India or the Middle East either. I think that’s gradually changing with increasing western influence, but traditionally, no. It’s a job and your employer is supposed to pay you. In Dubai, many restaurants charge a service fee which is part of the bill. This is far more acceptable than the unspoken obligation of ‘voluntarily tipping.’ With all the filth and decadence that saturates North American society it is pretty stupid that the morality police go after non tippers. Give me a break. I always tip, but that’s only because I believe in respecting local culture.

        • tulio

          “To a lot of people, “ghetto” = Black, and disabusing people of this idea seems to be the hardest thing on earth.”

          People typically think that way if they have no meaningful relationships with people from a certain group. I think making these distinctions becomes much easier if you have a friend or some friends from that group.

        • Alpha Unit

          I totally agree with you here.

        • Gay State Girl

          We don’t tip customer service people in malls, supermarkets, or service stations. I never heard of anyone tipping a janitor. Why restaurant servers expect to be treated specially is beyond me.

        • Chullo

          The origins of the belief that Jews are cheap and that Blacks don’t tip are obscure and shrouded in mystery.

        • Hacienda

          tulio,

          You got Japan wrong. In East Asia it is still considered rude to be primarily money motivated. And with whitey it still has some stigma, too. To give a tip for manual labor is an insult. Some of this has to do with the family oriented business environment. It’s an insult to tip “family”. They are just “doing their job”. Hard to say tipping should or shouldn’t be done. It’s just local thinking, you go with what’s done. In the US, to not tip is an insult. Unless it’s not done by blacks. Then it’s understood and explained away. When whites don’t tip it’s considered bad manners, rude, low, assholes. At least I think it still is. I haven’t waited since school.

        • Hacienda

          “They are just “doing their job”

          meant “They are NOT just doing their job.”

        • Gay State Girl

          We don’t tip clerks or Customer Service or manual laborers. Restaurant Janitors have a harder job than waiters and nobody thinks to tip them.

        • I take it you guys don’t tip the housekeepers at Motel 6 either!

        • Gay State Girl

          An Unmarried Man
          I was referring to “we” as a society don’t tip manual laborers involved custodial arts and waste management, who often have it worse than waiters. I ain’t black, I’m a jewish cunt.

        • I’m curious about how Jewish cunts tip. I would guess pretty well, actually.

          My badly phrased point was that the line between when we are expected to tip and when we aren’t is fuzzy. I didn’t know for along time that it was proper to tip motel housekeepers. For the longest time, all I left them was a bunch of empty beer bottles and cracked peanut shells.

          My most troublesome predicament: if you eat dinner at Carrow’s and then order a pie from your server (to go) afterward, do you tip off the total bill, pie included, or just for the cost of the meal? I usually go in between.

        • I ain’t black, I’m a jewish cunt.

          Your words kiddo, not mine.

          So you’re a JAC then?

  5. Skylar

    When I was in college I worked as a waiter at Red Lobster,and can say that in my experience Black customers were terrible tippers if they even tipped at all.

    • Hacienda

      “Black customers were terrible tippers…”

      • Hacienda

        “Black customers were terrible tippers…”

        Wanna say I agree. There really is no reason not to tip. It shows that you despise the waiter or waitress for some reason- at least in the US. Or that you believe you are in a dependent relationship to the “system” or “whitey” or “the world”, whatever. Which is true for about 80% of blacks living in the good ole’ USA.

        • Alpha Unit

          For some Black people, learning tipping etiquette was never part of their upbringing. For these people, the reason for not tipping doesn’t go any deeper than that.

        • Hacienda

          Alpha,

          That’s a good point. Glad you pointed that out. My Indiana KKK upbringing sometimes gets me carried away. LOL.

        • Gay State Girl

          Hacienda
          Does one of the K’s stand for Korean?

        • You never heard of the Ku Klux Koreans?

        • Hacienda

          GSG,

          Yeah, mid-west interracial relations. Shocking thing to experience, because in the cities blacks are sometimes 40% of population. Not like Los Angeles at 7%. The nakedness of the hate. Pornographic hate. Black on white, white on black, black on black, white on white. 3 blacks on 1 one white. 10 white men on 1 black girl. My favorite- hot, hot blond 1st year trainee English teacher on bad ass about-to-be-expelled Ebonic black boy sprint runner bused into new school (wonderland) and new to testorone. Sheesh. Blondies never look so poignant, so guuu-uud as when emotional pitch goes shrill, white-out, because of that groove thing.

  6. FG

    “This is an interesting view of what it is like to serve Black people in a large restaurant. The Blacks show up en masse for the cheapest meal of them all, which isn’t even very good for you either. Buffalo wings, mozzarella sticks and ranch dressing are full of fat and possibly salt too.”

    This is certainly not just a black thing. Did you ever go to college? That’s standard post- Saturday night drinking fare.

  7. Dano

    Unmarried man is exactly right.
    There’s no excuse for not tippong. Zero,
    That goes for anybody, poor or black.
    If you get lousy service, leave 10 to 15% instead of 20 and don,t go back to that servers station,
    When you stiff someone or leave a lousy tip after getting decent service, you’re an employer making someone work for free,
    The house pays shit. The min wage in restaurants is $2.15 an hr. and they take out taxes up front based on tips estimated, not actual tips. That results in paychecks totalling Zero or .50 cents at weeks end. I used to throw my paycheck in the wastebin with the other staff.
    Only cheaters and cheapskates don’t tip.

    • Hacienda

      “There’s no excuse for not tippong. Zero,”

      I agree. If you won’t tip, don’t eat out. It’s bullshit.

      • Uncle Milton

        To Hacienda and Dano:

        I agree. If you won’t tip, don’t eat out. It’s bullshit.

        I agree, albeit one can always go to that internationally famous Scottish restaurant and not be expected to tip: MacDonald’s.

  8. uncle tancred

    How about if they show up en masse, order cheap food, demand special treatment, don’t tip, all after having illegally parked in handicapped parking? Seen that about a million times.

  9. Dano

    Uncle tancred, you’re poopn’ on the comment section. Stop lying. Save that stuff for stormfront.
    Tulio, no one has passed any kind of judgement on blacks.
    We’ve simply made observations, the reasons for the behavior are up for speculation. Facts are facts. When you start discouraging people from discussing facts because of some unfounded fear of seeming un-PC you just make things worse.
    No one has said that all blacks are bad tippers. There are exceptions to every pattern. Obviously.
    And that argument you used, the old, hackneyed, incredibly weak logic of people shouldn’t be expected to tip because things aren’t as they should be, is silly and empty.
    Sure, the house should pay the servers a living wage, the Jews and Arabs should get along, but…ummmm…they don’t.
    Meanwhile that server has to eat, pay bills, and live. You can’t claim ignorance, and neither can the Canadians or Japanese. No cheap cop-outs please.
    Everyone who undertips and stiffs the servers knows exactly what they’re doing and the impact.
    We don’t live our lives based on how we think it ought to be, we live it based on how it actually is. That’s what separates the sane from the deranged.

    • Alpha Unit

      I want to mention, Dano, that I see the point you’re making. What amazes me is the fascination people have with Black behavior.

      • Dota

        I agree Alpha Unit. (East) Indians behave pretty badly too. Bad driving and lack of civic sense instantly come to mind. This behavior is quite common in India but persists within the dispora as well.

        • Hacienda

          “(East) Indians behave pretty badly too.”

          Yeah, I’ll say. Indians seem to be on a world-wide bitch crusade. Nice facade, but prick them just a little an the sewage busts out.

  10. uncle tancred

    Say…what? Must be a cohesive response in there somewhere. You must not actually ever park in a public parking lot, or just not notice things like that. Or it’s you who is lying. Dunno

    • Dano

      “Cohesive” is not the word you’re looking for. “Cogent” maybe?
      I grew up on the edge of browntown, closer to the railroad tracks than the Blues Brothers. I’m familiar with human behavior, and I know the street.
      Your comment was facetious and fabricated.

      Alpha Unit, I’m glad you understand what I was saying.

  11. Eliza

    I was on the boardwalk in AC yesterday. Saw a white family at an outdoor bar. Obviously, children are not permitted in bars. The family had a child young enough to still be in a stroller. This is rarely an indication of age in white families since they allow tweens to be pushed in strollers. This child, in my estimation, was between four and six years old. The adults left the child parked in the stroller just outside of the fence while they drank inside the fence. I photographed this appalling occurrence with the intention of posting the pictures on this site but have been unsuccessful in my attempts to upload these pictures. As a black diner AND a server at a family restaurant I would rather see a child INSIDE a restaurant eating at 11:30 pm (when whites usually have their children in bed) than see a child LEFT OUTSIDE of a restaurant while his adult family members imbibe alcohol.

  12. Eliza

    And the comments policy is basically this: Robert and every one who agrees with him can accuse that, as a black woman, I am promiscuious, dishonest, beligerent, cheap, broke, antisocial, rude, disrespectful, and a bad mother. But OH LAWD!!!!! Don’t let anyone suggest that Robert may be WRONG or malicious or as bigotted as the Nazis. I have red numerous comments on this site posted by people with similar views towards minorities (similar to Robert). One Caveman even ventured to refer to people of Jewish descent as “Kikes”. Racial slurs from the unenlightened are welcomed on this site. Apparently, hypocrisy is encouraged. People are permitted to disagree as long as they do so apologetically. The slanderous accusation that black women sold their bodies while white women were virgins was not made apologetically. But any honest reaction to it will be banned. Only opinions that are welcomed are ones that agree with Robert. This comment policy is not surprising when one considers the originator of the policy

  13. Eliza

    The world may not be fundamentally hostile but the US is, as evidenced by the hateful, malicious, racist people who post on this site.

    • Chullo

      You appear to be too stupid to realise people outside the US have access to the internet. I wish I could say I was surprised.

  14. Gay State Girl

    Dear Eliza
    Most people who post on this site do not harbor hostility towards blacks as a group. This blog just provides an alternative to the usual crap found in the ultra PC left wing blogosphere and serves as an outlet for people who experience frustration in an increasingly polarized world.

    • tulio

      Racist are pretty easy to pick off and show for morons if you’ve had experience dealing with them. They hardly even bother me at this point. I’ve been desensitized to them. These type of forum racists are mostly harmless trolls with no real power in life so they vent online. The real people you have to worry about are the ones you’ll never hear a racist comment from. The one that will smile in your face and then say “sorry we’re not hiring”.

  15. Eliza

    I would expect a carpet muncher to be more open minded Gay State Girl. I guess you figured since homosexuality is already an abomination you’d just go the whole nine yards and buy a ticket straight to Hell. I completely understand and respect the non PC opinions of others. There seems to be a lack of insight directed inwardly amongst You People. My friends marvel at the fact that I am the first to concur with most stereotypes. Black people do talk through movies (mostly Ebonics). Black people are horrible customers in any setting, especially restaurants. Black women think its a great idea to take a man’s name and add “Asia” on the end to name their daughters after their fathers. I know a girl named Mackasia. White People can’t dance. White women have flat asses. White men have little dicks. White people don’t properly discipline their kids. White people are disloyal (your white girlfriend will fuck best friends, brothers, cousins with no shame). White people will talk shit to you and then call police QUICK. White people smell like wet dogs. All white girls look alike and they’re unattractive. The only pretty white girls have black features (Angelina Jolie, Scarlett Johannsen). White people are PUNKS (especially white boys, they’re the biggest pussies on earth). White girls are sluts. All you have to do is ask them and you can fuck them. White women think its cool to murder their children (Casey Anthony). White kids commit mass murder at schools (Columbine). I could go on and on all day about the shortcomings of Crackers. You People really need to clean out your own backyards before you go knocking on your neighbors’ doors. Especially your black neighbors because you know you’ll get your little dick, flat asses kicked. And if the Gay State Cunteater is so big on free speech, feel FREE to talk that shit you think about black people in the hood.

  16. Eliza

    Skylar you have just completely validated my argument that You People make statements without any factual data to support them. Why don’t you do some research on the racial breakdown of welfare recipients and get back to me if you don’t feel too stupid once you find evidence that Crackers make up the MAJORITY of people receiving public assistance. So, actually, I am working and paying taxes so Trailer Trash Queens such as yourself can sit in your double wide eating the racoon your incestuous daddy(who’s also your grandfather) shot in the front yard before he and your uncles(who are also your brothers) run a train on your flat ass. But you’ll enjoy it, I’m

    • Chullo

      Chimp-out time!
      “Crackers make up the MAJORITY of people receiving public assistance”
      Dat’s cuz White’s be 80% of populayshun n’ shit.

      • Statistics in the wrong hands are a dangerous force

      • Eliza

        Exactly Einstein. Since Crackers make up approximately 67%(not 80% check your facts and come at me correct) of the US population, they make up the greatest percentage of welfare recipients(61% as opposed to 18% Black). And Chullo, I am dead right when I say white boys are pussies.

        • mott 69

          Eliza-stein- Ever take Statistics? Blacks as a group receive welfare at by far the highest rate. Whites as a group receive it at the lowest rate of all major groups.
          This is far more significant, logically, when assessing the extent of whether an issue is huge problem or not.
          The sheer numbers of all statistics in the U.S. are skewed by the preponderance of Whites as a percentage of total pop.. (It used to be 80% until fairly recently- the Illexicans took care of that).

          All due respect- Until you know how to interpret statistics, I would suggest you not use them.

        • But c’mon, whites make up 61% of all welfare recipients. Wow!!!!

          Ironic that she’s asking us to check our facts. Haha. That’s the problem here. Facts, especially in the statistic realm, are only as useful in the context they are viewed, but Eliza’s grasp of this obviously sucks.

    • Uncle Milton

      To Eliza:
      find evidence that Crackers make up the MAJORITY of people receiving public assistance.

      If by public assistance, you mean TANF (Temporary Aid for Needy Families…) formerly known as AFDC there is no single racial or ethnic group that makes up the majority (as in higher than 50%) of recipients. However Blacks as a group receive more than any other group. See the figures below:

      Currently what is typically known as welfare is known as TANF. (Changed from AFDC to TANF in the 90s…)

      The latest figures for TANF (2008) recipients by race are:

      Black 34.2 %
      White 31.5 %
      Hispanic 28.0 %

      Reference:
      http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/ofa/character/FY2008/tab08.htm

      • Hacienda

        Archie Bunker, Tragic Hero

        • Uncle Milton

          To Hacienda:

          That show sucked balls… and not in a good way.. and it was a rip off a British television as was another Norman Lear production Sanford & Son. The latter at least had the usually entertaining Redd Foxx although it was filled with stereotypes.

        • Hacienda

          UM,

          Prole revenge entertainment. Not seen for what it was at that time, except by Norman Lear. Steven Speilberg said that the US can return to Mayberry someday. Ha. Maybe.I always liked the WASP family TV shows – The Brady Bunch, My Favorite Martian. Remarkable thing, Korean TV has some of the warmth and odd situational, but not mean, humor that pre- All in the Family shows had. The Jew shows- Ugh and Ugh. LOL. Notice that Edith swags like a Jew in drag. Nice bit of casting by Norman Lear. Yeah, Red Foxx. Funny, funny man.

  17. Eliza

    Chullo, I appear to be smart enough to know that R-E-A-L-I-Z-E is spelled with a Z. I am also smart enough to know that the hate mongers on this site are, sadly, AMERICANS.

    • Chullo

      Realise is spelt with an S in the UK. … And spelt is usually used for spelled. Welcome to the world outside the ghetto.

    • ski

      lol, the irony is that “realise,” is an acceptable (though not common I think) variant in British English. Way to prove yourself one of those “sadly,” AMERICANS.

  18. Eliza

    Gay State Girl, I totally owe you an apology. I confused someone else’s hateful remark with you. I was so wrong. Please don’t judge me as a homophobe or a racist. I am a biracial lesbian myself and only said such things to anger you. I apologize.

    • ski

      LOL Robert, you should reconsider the ban on this lesbonigger, she might be fun to have around.

      And btw I’m a heterosexual male half descended from East Euro ex-serfs so I know all about being oppressed… any descent lesboniggers– please don’t hold this comment against me, I know all about being oppressed by the WASP, the Mongol and the Szlachta and I’m totally with all the other oppressed minorities even though they’re a little less oppressed than me– I’m just try’n to piss off this one particular biracial lesbian.

      • Justin

        I thought “banned” meant Robert blocked them from continuing to post. Someone enlighten me.

        • Banned means I try to block them from posting. However, there are ways around the ban if you know what you are doing with computers. A lot of people get banned, then monkey with things so they can come back after the ban. A lot of times, I let them come back. When they come back, they are often trying to be good and not violate the rules. You can also petition bans, but almost no one ever does it. People who return after bans have a high rate of getting rebanned.

          Some of the biggest commenters here have actually been banned. Tulio was actually banned when he first showed up. He monkeyed with his settings and came back and he’s been good ever since. If they circumvent a ban but agree with the Rules, I let them stay.

    • Gay State Girl

      “I am a biracial lesbian myself and only said such things to anger you. I apologize.”

      See I told you homosexuals are the biggest homophobes.

  19. Deb

    This thread and the comments sadden me. I honestly thought that such attitudes and behaviors were a thing of the past, mostly.

    When I was six, my father moved us from New Jersey to Appalachia, NC. Located in what was then the poorest county in NC, my aunt was left a pin factory. Her (Jewish, if that means anything) husband dropped dead on the factory floor. Family meant everything to my Da. He was climbing the corporate ladder within RCA.
    This all happened in 1957.

    My father did two things when he took the factory over: it went 24 hours/7 days a week. 2)He desegregated the place. NO more “White” or “Colored” anything. Everyone got a shot at prime hours. He also fired the lazy people who my deceased uncle had kept on because he felt sorry for the families of the bums.

    My mother was Irish born and a staunch Catholic. She went to the Archbishop all the way in Asheville demanding a church be built. NO one said no to her, NO ONE! The Church bought the land, hired contractors and assigned a brand new priest smack outta the seminary to us. Father Tom was/is a hoot, fine man.

    For two weeks, everything that had been built during the day was torn down. One night, we were all awakened by the KKK.

    You know those movies where a huge cross is erected, and big men on bigger horses, and dressed in white, gallop around a house and the flaming cross, shrieking obscenities? Dead on.

    Word travels fast in the country. The next day, our Black housekeeper showed up before dawn, her father drove her in his mule drawn buckboard. He sat outside on a lawn chair, his shotgun across his lap. We were all family. Miss Sue stayed with Mother and the brothers, Da took me to the factory. He instructed his secretary to call EVERYONE in, they had to be there in one hour.

    My Da was a tall man, flaming red hair, Navy cut, and soft spoken. When the machines were silenced, and all there, my Da spoke, “If my family can’t worship as you do, I will shut this place down. I have no patience with this,” never mentioning what happened. The foreman stepped up, “Why, Mr. Bill, I thought you were one of our boys,” as if my father would have been happy to get rid of those Papists. “No, I am a Methodist, but I made a vow I would raise my children Catholic. I don’t break promises. And I promise that I will shut this place down. I am giving everyone 3 days off, with pay. Make your decision, I have made mine.” He went to his office, called Tom and told him meet at our house. Da and I went to the hardware store, and bought nails, hammers, screw drivers and such.

    We walked into the kitchen, Da dumped the boxes on the table and announced, “Tom, we’re gonna build a church.” Neither one of ‘em knew anything about building a Lincoln Log toy structure, let alone a church, but for three days, they labored in the hot NC sun. And every night, the church grew. At the end of three days, my Da walked into the factory, everyone was at their station, waiting for his word. He stood quietly, looked every person there in the eye, a long look. Then…he nodded, and the factory roared to life again. The contractors came back, the tiny church was built, and the congregation grew under Tom’s sweet ministrations. (He was a rebel, when he ran outta sacramental wine, he substituted moonshine! He’s a whole nother story.)

    I’ve seen the race riots and the civil rights struggle. I’ve done my time and efforts for feminism.. But after reading the comments, I am so sad…has nothing changed…anger, hatred, bias and bigotry.

    But as my Da said, “Human nature is human nature, we can only change ourselves and hope someone else hops onto our wagon.”

  20. skylar

    I just pasted these from a government site:

    With regard to AFDC the figures are:

    White 38.8%
    Black 39.8
    Hispanic 15.7
    Asian 2.4
    other 3.3

    To break down these numbers, we look at how many Whites are in the population as a WHOLE. If Blacks make up less 14% of the population and are almost 40% of all receipients, then they represent about 2.5 times their actual population. Since Whites are over 50% of the total US pop., they represent less than their overall piece of the pie, population-wise. Hispanics are at least 15% of the general population, so they take only about as much as what their population represents. Why am I writing this? Because I am tired of the misrepresentations on this issue. I read so many on here claiming that more Whites are on welfare than Blacks (true, in terms of raw numbers), yet not accounting for the fact that there are over 4X as many Whites in this country than Blacks! In statistics, you cannot go by mere numbers. Only if the playing field is exactly equal, which is rarely is! This thread was started, not to be racist, but to keep it real. After all, there are some legitimate reasons for Blacks to be on welfare more than Whites. But the worst thing anyone can do is be in denial

    • More Blacks are on welfare than Whites, it is true.

      We don’t mind so much, as this is a socialist blog and we support welfare. But we do want some changes in it.

    • tulio

      I think there has been a large spike up in blacks on welfare the last few years because of the economy. When it tanks, blacks(and Hispanics too) are hit much harder as a general rule. So while you may see welfare use for all groups go up for all groups during an acute downturn like we’ve experienced, it will hit some groups particularly hard. When the economy recovers(if it ever does), you may also see the black numbers go down by at a greater rate than the white rate. Plus keep in mind that whites have more wealth through stocks and home equity than blacks do. So they have other sources to carry them through hard times. And yes, it’s easier for a white to find a job than a black as has been found by field studies, though of course most blacks who are good at what they do and have an in-demand skill will find work.

    • FG

      When considering stats like these, you also have to consider that a big chunk of Hispanics are here illegally or are related to people who are. If Latino had the same rates of citizenship as African Americans, they would surely constitute a larger share of public service usage.

    • Uncle Milton

      To Skylar:

      Your figures are a little dated. Currently what is typically known as welfare is known as TANF. (Changed from AFDC to TANF in the 90s…)

      The latest figures for TANF (2008) recipients by race are:

      Black 34.2 %
      White 31.5 %
      Hispanic 28.0 %

      Reference:
      http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/ofa/character/FY2008/tab08.htm

      Pre recession figures:
      Black 35.5 %
      White 32.4 %
      Hispanic 27 %

      Reference:
      http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/ofa/character/FY2007/tab08.htm

      By the 2010 Census the US population is:

      Black 12.6
      White 63.7
      Hispanic 16.3

      Reference:
      http://www.census.gov/prod/cen2010/briefs/c2010br-02.pdf

      • Gay State Girl

        Only 63.7% white. That’s too much for me to digest. The Gay State is still 80% white.

        • Bay Area Guy

          Not hard for me to digest at all, GSG. In fact, I’m surprised it’s not even lower, especially considering our idiot government lumps in certain Hispanics and Middle Easterners as “white” (and to be clear, I do believe that there can be white HIspanics and Middle Easterners, but let’s face it, most of them don’t identify as white and most of them are brown).

          Here in Cali, whites are only 40% of the population, and that percentage is even smaller among young people. Not to mention that, again, I’m sure that there are some “whites” who aren’t.

          Enjoy your miniature whitetopia while it lasts, GSG! :-)

          Because if you think the browning of America is going to be confined to border states, you’ve got another thing coming!

  21. Gay State Girl

    Lindsay
    Would you say that social services provide a green light for unstable people to go and have more children?

      • Gay State Girl

        Lindsay
        People with low IQ’s or emotional or financial instability are outbreeding their high IQ counterparts, in some cases having large families, while educated professionals have no children at all. This is a bigger phenomenon in European countries which have national health care and free early childhood education programs. In many cases, poor immigrant populations outbreed native populations.
        It’s a double edged sword. On the one hand, social services improve lifestyles for poor and prevent them from commiting crimes (though some may disagree) but guaranteed social services also encourage people with low IQ’s or instability to have more children and intelligence is 40-80% hereditary.so investing in the education of children of parents with low IQ’s might not yield positive results.

        • tulio

          But hasn’t this always been the case? If it were dragging down IQs then there should be no Flynn effect. We’d all be getting collectively dumber. Yet each generation is getting smarter. So I’m not sure I buy the argument that poor people breeding is dragging down the average IQ.

        • Gay State Girl

          Tulio
          Poor outbreeding the rich is a relatively recent phenomenon. Historically, the more successful were able to outbreed the less successful so we don’t much to compare it to. It is true that the iq’s of minority have risen significantly, though this generally happened during the mid 20th century before educated professionals stopped having children at all. In any case, I am worried that a welfare state will lead to a custodial state, as many rich liberals think they can do a better job raising other people’s children (which is certainly not the case.)

        • Dota

          Is that why the Brahmins are less than 5% of India’s population?

        • A welfare state is based on the notion that people have a right to survive. Poor people, dumb people, whatever. It doesn’t matter. Fertility rates in the US are awfully low, and they’re low for poor people too. They’re even low for Blacks.

          This is not a new thing. They were complaining about this in the Roman Empire – the rich having no kids and the poor having lots.

        • Gay State Girl

          Lindsay
          That may have been the original idea of the Welfare state but a lot has changed since the time then. It’s more complicated in practice than it is in theory. Some would argue that if the government-and by extension the taxpayer-is required to provide for you, they also have the right to enforce certain regulations. People generally are not so critical of others, (though there are many notable exceptions) as long as their behavior does not directly affect them. But people may be judgemental of others if they have to support them.

          I would like to decrease the disparity in wealth by increasing salaries and employee benefits (as well as societal respect) for manual laborers and support employee-ownership whenever possible but make people work for their money and encourage people to be self reliant and only have as many children as they can afford to feed.

          There a lot of things that I like about blacks, hispanics, and poor whites than I do about rich whites and ethic. I think poor people have a stronger work ethic, generally have less class based prejudices, tend to be less judgemental, and don’t feel that they’re too good to clean their own houses, as many intellectual jerks feel.

  22. Gay State Girl

    Dota
    Don’t twist my words. The US and Europe are very different places than India and Brahmins are very different from westerners. But I’m sure that the religious (Hindu, Muslim, or Sikh) Indians outbreed secularized, westernized

    I know this is a controversial topic, but I brought it up because I’ve noticed a phenomenon of financially unstable, often unmarried women having large families and then relying on the state of religious institutions to support them. I am not implying that their children should not receive equal health care or appropriate K-12 education, just that providing all that-and not enforcing birth control among unstable women-does not help them in the long run.

    • Dota

      How am I twisting your words? In every society its the less successful that out breed the successful ones simply because the former are the majority while the later are the minority. Certain minorities are parasitic in nature and practice selective breeding while keeping their numbers as low as possible. You’re stating the obvious and trying to pass it of as an epiphany.

      • Gay State Girl

        You are twisting my words because you paint me as some kind of selfish narcissist just because I made a comment about financially unstable people having large families that they can not afford to keep and attribute that (partly) to policy and culture. I did not suggest poor or low IQ people should be treated as second class citizens or promote eugenics, I just made an observation about financially unstable people making unwise decisions and behave irresponsibly and expect society (government or charitable organizations) to pay for their mistakes.
        I made this observation because the woman who takes care of my grandmother is on her ninth child with a man who beats her, as her previous boyfriends did in the past. She has been “rescued” in the past by many social workers who have told her not to have more children with abusive men and given her various birth control options, which she has denied as they violate her religion.
        Many poor people are religious and refuse to use birth control or have abortions for religious reasons and expect society to comply with their religious beliefs.

  23. Car Guy

    An augmentation — genetic or otherwise — that gives everyone an IQ of 110 or higher is probably not that far away.

    • Gay State Girl

      That would favor the upper class and the first world as it typically would be more available to them and give them get another competitive advantage over the lower classes and the third world.

      • Car Guy

        Initially, yes, but not forever. Assuming that those who developed it are the sharing type, the innovation will eventually trickle down to all ranks. That’s how things always work.

    • Dota

      Funny you should mention that, I just started playing Deus Ex Human Revolution today. The Deus Ex series has always been unusually philosophical for a shooter.

      • Bay Area Guy

        Good to encounter a fellow gaming nerd, Dota!

        Though I don’t play Deus Ex! ;-)

        • Dota

          @ BAG

          This entire augmentation debate was the theme of Deus Ex Invisible war. Would augmentations make talent obsolete? How would it impact individualism? It’s an awesome game. Plus the Illuminati make an appearance in the game and you may assassinate their leadership if you wish. This game was made for Johnny boy! But there aren’t any chechens though

        • Bay Area Guy

          Plus the Illuminati make an appearance in the game and you may assassinate their leadership if you wish. This game was made for Johnny boy! But there aren’t any chechens though

          LOL! :-) :-) :-)

          Is it a computer game? Because I just have a shitty macbook that can’t play any games.

        • Bay Area Guy

          @ Dota

          Is it possible to issue a fatwa in the game? That would really be Johnny Boy’s wet dream!

        • Gay State Girl

          John is a rare gem.

      • Car Guy

        Yea. And reading the reviews, it seems that Deus Ex: Human Revolution is not as well received as the original. I have never played either games; when I was a game addict, I use to be a Nintendo fanboy.

        • Dota

          What are you talking about? It received a good rating on gamespot and ign. All dues ex games are pc and ps. Anyhow human revolution seems to be a much bigger version of invisible war. Huge cities, lots of characters to interact with, lots of side missions. And you can choke slam hookers ;)
          Raiding the morgue of the Detroit police station was a blast!

        • Car Guy

          I haven’t played it yet, but after watching a few videos, some of which have been reviews, I think it would have been a better game if EA had been the producer and publisher. As much as people hate that company, it has the technology. I’m sure it’s a good game, but good character animation and AI is something that Human Evolution is lacking, according to the critics.

    • Hacienda

      “IQ of 110 ”

      If genetics can boost IQ by 10, then why not 100? There are people with 200 IQ. And what’s the limit of IQ for a protein brain? Not sure a world of 200 IQ people wouldn’t be an absolute meaningless hell, a dead end.

      Reversion to the mean. The call of God.

      • Car Guy

        I could have said and IQ of 200, which I think is doable, but I didn’t want to get carried away. I don’t know the limits of the human brain, but savants give us an idea. IQ does not equate to overall intelligence. For instance, I think that IQ and creativity are very distinct from each, although they may work off each other. Even with equal IQ, some people will still be more inventive, crazy, athletic, etc.

        Economically, equal IQs would not erase social classes because not everyone would have the same interests, drive, talent, etc., although we will be more wealthy on average. Things always find a way to balance out.

  24. Gay State Girl

    I hope so. I am worried that genetic modification will ultimately be used for more selfish purposes, such as cosmetics.

    • Car Guy

      Oh, there is without a doubt that they will be used for other reasons. You can bet on that. But why would that be bad?

      • Gay State Girl

        It appears to be benign but it would eliminate human variation but mankind is not perfect and we should not make it appear so.

        Some religious fundamentalists would say genetic engineering is altering with G-d’s work. I would not go so far, but I know this much: Mother nature always wins against modern medicine and advanced technology. My generation has seen all kinds of unexpected consequences to psychiatric medications, plastic surgeries, and vaccines.

        • Car Guy

          Yea, I agree with all of that. I wouldn’t want a world where we all looked and even acted very similar. But I think there is only a small chance that such extremes would be reached, especially in the West. I’m not too sure about East Asia, Africa and South America, though.

        • tulio

          That would be awesome. Every woman born would be a perfect 10 with large breasts. Genetic modification for all!

        • Gay State Girl

          Tulio
          It’s not all it’s cracked up to be. All the women in my family are very petite but have really large breasts which is not a good combination. In addition to being severely limited as to what I can wear and having to buy “Grandma bras” at Lady Grace, I have difficulty participating in athletic activities and have back pains at the end of the day.

    • Oh yes, goes without saying.

      All the money will be in genetically engineered physical alterations. I don’t believe enough people give a crap about IQ to make that a money-maker.

      • Gay State Girl

        An Unmarried Man
        Appearance will be harder to alter than intelligence, as it typically involves multiple organs and body parts to code for. It would be more expensive and could involve serious damage if not done correctly. Many women have died in this process of cosmetic surgery, including Kanye West’s mother, so cosmetic engineering is very dangerous territory.

        • How on earth would we “code” for intelligence when we can’t even agree on what it is and how it should be expressed? “Easier” to manipulate red hair, I would think.

        • Car Guy

          I think it’s harder to code for intelligence than it is for other body organs and features, which is why I didn’t say intelligence. I think that IQ, as only one part of overall intelligence, will be easier to augment than the other parts of intelligence. But I think that once IQ is increased, there is more room for ones imagination, creativity and other faculties of intelligence to work.

          IQ is not everything, and everyone having the same IQ, even when all social-economic factors are equal, does not mean everyone will be equally intelligent. Still, modifying IQ would still be challenging, but I think it’s very doable. You’ll be surprised at how malleable the human brain is.

  25. Gay State Girl

    An Unmarried Man
    There are multiple genes coding for any given organ.

    Of course if something goes wrong with engineering of the brain, it could turn out horribly as well.

    But when we mess with mother nature, we enter dangerous territory.

  26. Pingback: Linkage is Good for You: School’s in Session Edition

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